Discussion:
How would you save the Star Trek franchise from total extinction?
(too old to reply)
unknown
2005-01-28 20:09:48 UTC
Permalink
"Napolean Dynamite/ w Deb" <Hey Deb, Wanna See My Liger? It's Pretty Much
My
The Seven Of Nine channel? All Seven, all the time?
That didn't work for Voyager, so why would it work now?
She came in after the damage was already done with those 4 horrible, boring
seasons and made it watchable for a little bit, then it went back to
successfully killing the Star Trek franchise. It wasn't her fault...don't
blame the hot borg babe with superior intellect!
Wickeddoll®
2005-01-28 20:19:26 UTC
Permalink
"Napolean Dynamite/ w Deb" <Hey Deb, Wanna See My Liger? It's Pretty Much My
Post by unknown
"Napolean Dynamite/ w Deb" <Hey Deb, Wanna See My Liger? It's Pretty Much
My
The Seven Of Nine channel? All Seven, all the time?
That didn't work for Voyager, so why would it work now?
She came in after the damage was already done with those 4 horrible, boring
seasons and made it watchable for a little bit, then it went back to
successfully killing the Star Trek franchise. It wasn't her fault...don't
blame the hot borg babe with superior intellect!
Not at all, I'm just saying the gimmick didn't really keep the viewers as had
been hoped. It figures that this season would be the one where Enterprise
becomes true Trek. Although I would miss Enterprise (I'm a trekkie, what can
I say?), I think putting the franchise on hold for about 5 years would be a
good idea as well. I think Paramount is too paranoid to believe that the
franchise could withstand any absence, which is absurd, when you remember
that TOS had been canceled several years before TNG.

BTW, I *like* Ryan, but I got just as tired of the Doctor as I did of her.
Seven was a great idea, but Braga and Berman made the series less of an
ensemble (Trek's strength) and more window-dressing for Braga's honey and
that obnoxious Doctor. Too bad.

I still believe Kate Mulgrew's Janeway was the most fascinating and
interesting Trek captain yet, and I'm not afraid to say so! (It wasn't
Mulgrew or Janeway's fault that they wrote as a schizophrenic :-P)

Natalie
vrooooom
2005-01-28 21:27:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wickeddoll®
"Napolean Dynamite/ w Deb" <Hey Deb, Wanna See My Liger? It's Pretty Much My
Post by unknown
"Napolean Dynamite/ w Deb" <Hey Deb, Wanna See My Liger? It's Pretty Much
My
The Seven Of Nine channel? All Seven, all the time?
That didn't work for Voyager, so why would it work now?
She came in after the damage was already done with those 4 horrible, boring
seasons and made it watchable for a little bit, then it went back to
successfully killing the Star Trek franchise. It wasn't her fault...don't
blame the hot borg babe with superior intellect!
Not at all, I'm just saying the gimmick didn't really keep the viewers as had
been hoped. It figures that this season would be the one where Enterprise
becomes true Trek. Although I would miss Enterprise (I'm a trekkie, what can
I say?), I think putting the franchise on hold for about 5 years would be a
good idea as well. I think Paramount is too paranoid to believe that the
franchise could withstand any absence, which is absurd, when you remember
that TOS had been canceled several years before TNG.
BTW, I *like* Ryan, but I got just as tired of the Doctor as I did of her.
Seven was a great idea, but Braga and Berman made the series less of an
ensemble (Trek's strength) and more window-dressing for Braga's honey and
that obnoxious Doctor. Too bad.
I still believe Kate Mulgrew's Janeway was the most fascinating and
interesting Trek captain yet, and I'm not afraid to say so! (It wasn't
Mulgrew or Janeway's fault that they wrote as a schizophrenic :-P)
Natalie
I agree with you Matalie.
Janeway was a facinating character.
Seven was a gimick that shoujld have been dumped into the sixth season,
and the doctor whould have been less a pain in the ass, what whit his
dumbass "missions" of proving holograms are people too bullcrap.
Should have been more ships from the Alpha quadrant and the Gamma
quadrant coming into the Delta quadrant to screw with voyager... I was
sad to see good characters go to waste. Way too bad that Braga was
thinking with his jeans instead of his brain...
In fact, Braga should have been canned into the second season of VOY.

Once again,
Vrooooom
Wickeddoll®
2005-01-28 21:32:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by vrooooom
"Napolean Dynamite/ w Deb" <Hey Deb, Wanna See My Liger? It's Pretty Much
Post by unknown
"Napolean Dynamite/ w Deb" <Hey Deb, Wanna See My Liger? It's Pretty Much
My
The Seven Of Nine channel? All Seven, all the time?
That didn't work for Voyager, so why would it work now?
She came in after the damage was already done with those 4 horrible, boring
seasons and made it watchable for a little bit, then it went back to
successfully killing the Star Trek franchise. It wasn't her fault...don't
blame the hot borg babe with superior intellect!
Not at all, I'm just saying the gimmick didn't really keep the viewers as
had been hoped. It figures that this season would be the one where
Enterprise becomes true Trek. Although I would miss Enterprise (I'm a
trekkie, what can I say?), I think putting the franchise on hold for about
5 years would be a good idea as well. I think Paramount is too paranoid
to believe that the franchise could withstand any absence, which is
absurd, when you remember that TOS had been canceled several years before
TNG.
BTW, I *like* Ryan, but I got just as tired of the Doctor as I did of her.
Seven was a great idea, but Braga and Berman made the series less of an
ensemble (Trek's strength) and more window-dressing for Braga's honey and
that obnoxious Doctor. Too bad.
I still believe Kate Mulgrew's Janeway was the most fascinating and
interesting Trek captain yet, and I'm not afraid to say so! (It wasn't
Mulgrew or Janeway's fault that they wrote as a schizophrenic :-P)
Natalie
I agree with you Matalie.
Janeway was a facinating character.
Seven was a gimick that shoujld have been dumped into the sixth season, and
the doctor whould have been less a pain in the ass, what whit his dumbass
"missions" of proving holograms are people too bullcrap.
Should have been more ships from the Alpha quadrant and the Gamma quadrant
coming into the Delta quadrant to screw with voyager... I was sad to see
good characters go to waste. Way too bad that Braga was thinking with his
jeans instead of his brain...
In fact, Braga should have been canned into the second season of VOY.
Once again,
Vrooooom
True - Braga's a talented writer (He wrote my fave TNG movie, First Contact),
but I think he was just burned out. He was viciously attacked during Q&A at
the '02 Vegas Trek con, but to his credit, he was very gracious to the very
rude guy who slammed him. One can certainly air their opinions without being
nasty.

Natalie
Kweeg
2005-01-28 21:50:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by vrooooom
Post by Wickeddoll®
"Napolean Dynamite/ w Deb" <Hey Deb, Wanna See My Liger? It's Pretty Much My
Post by unknown
"Napolean Dynamite/ w Deb" <Hey Deb, Wanna See My Liger? It's Pretty Much
My
The Seven Of Nine channel? All Seven, all the time?
That didn't work for Voyager, so why would it work now?
She came in after the damage was already done with those 4 horrible, boring
seasons and made it watchable for a little bit, then it went back to
successfully killing the Star Trek franchise. It wasn't her
fault...don't
Post by vrooooom
Post by Wickeddoll®
Post by unknown
blame the hot borg babe with superior intellect!
Not at all, I'm just saying the gimmick didn't really keep the viewers as had
been hoped. It figures that this season would be the one where Enterprise
becomes true Trek. Although I would miss Enterprise (I'm a trekkie, what can
I say?), I think putting the franchise on hold for about 5 years would be a
good idea as well. I think Paramount is too paranoid to believe that the
franchise could withstand any absence, which is absurd, when you remember
that TOS had been canceled several years before TNG.
BTW, I *like* Ryan, but I got just as tired of the Doctor as I did of her.
Seven was a great idea, but Braga and Berman made the series less of an
ensemble (Trek's strength) and more window-dressing for Braga's honey and
that obnoxious Doctor. Too bad.
I still believe Kate Mulgrew's Janeway was the most fascinating and
interesting Trek captain yet, and I'm not afraid to say so! (It wasn't
Mulgrew or Janeway's fault that they wrote as a schizophrenic :-P)
Natalie
I agree with you Matalie.
Janeway was a facinating character.
Seven was a gimick that shoujld have been dumped into the sixth season,
and the doctor whould have been less a pain in the ass, what whit his
dumbass "missions" of proving holograms are people too bullcrap.
Should have been more ships from the Alpha quadrant and the Gamma
quadrant coming into the Delta quadrant to screw with voyager... I was
sad to see good characters go to waste. Way too bad that Braga was
thinking with his jeans instead of his brain...
The Doctor, 7 of 9 and Tuvok were the only characters worth anything. The
captain and the helmsman were slightly less annoying than Nelix who shoulda
have been spaced right away along with Kes, the wooden XO, the precocious
1/2 Klingon, and the Ensign that didn't do anything except whimper and
occasionally cower.
Post by vrooooom
In fact, Braga should have been canned into the second season of VOY.
Concur!
--
Qa'pla
Kweeg
http://members.shaw.ca/iksbloodoath
Justin
2005-01-28 22:49:34 UTC
Permalink
Oh yea fuck... seriously... excuse my language, but I really had to use that
*F word. First... I'm a star trek fan. When voyager came out, I watched a
few episodes for the first one, one and a half month, then... never ever,
ever... watched another episode of VOY again! Until... one day, a big
breast talented princess came along replaced the boring dull not bad looking
but never showed her ass/breast Kess.

You know what... I have nothing against voyager, nothing against Captain
Janeway, she's okay, but I really really want to compact the cook Neelix,
and burn it, then toss it out the air-lock. You know... some people... they
just... unwilling to admit that Neelix, and maybe Kess are the characters
that killed VOY, why are there even people defending these 2
characters?!?!!?

Someone called Seven of Nine a gimmick!? If it isn't Seven of Nine... the
show does not exist, VOY would of gone down as a shame in Star Trek history,
if it hasn't already. If they somehow included Section 31st in VOY, it
might of been half watchable without Seven.
Post by Kweeg
Post by vrooooom
I agree with you Matalie.
Janeway was a facinating character.
Seven was a gimick that shoujld have been dumped into the sixth season,
and the doctor whould have been less a pain in the ass, what whit his
dumbass "missions" of proving holograms are people too bullcrap.
Should have been more ships from the Alpha quadrant and the Gamma
quadrant coming into the Delta quadrant to screw with voyager... I was
sad to see good characters go to waste. Way too bad that Braga was
thinking with his jeans instead of his brain...
The Doctor, 7 of 9 and Tuvok were the only characters worth anything. The
captain and the helmsman were slightly less annoying than Nelix who shoulda
have been spaced right away along with Kes, the wooden XO, the precocious
1/2 Klingon, and the Ensign that didn't do anything except whimper and
occasionally cower.
Post by vrooooom
In fact, Braga should have been canned into the second season of VOY.
The Merry Piper
2005-01-28 23:22:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Justin
Someone called Seven of Nine a gimmick!? If it isn't Seven of Nine... the
show does not exist, VOY would of gone down as a shame in Star Trek history,
if it hasn't already. If they somehow included Section 31st in VOY, it
might of been half watchable without Seven.
How does the show existing or not existing negate the fact that a
large majority of the fan base sees Ryan being cast as 7 of 9 a
gimmick?

Yeah ... when I think half-human/half-machine rescued from an insect
like collective dressed in a cat-suit, CMFP high heels, padded chest
plate, & corset.

It is possible, perhaps, that an early cancellation of VOY would have
led to some serious soul searching on the part of TPTB & maybe given
us, the fans, a better product.

I think it is wonderful you loved the character & loved the show.
IDIC and all that. It doesn't mean the rest of us won't look at some
of the choices made & questio them.

---
The Merry Piper
[http://tmpiper.livejournal.com]
The Seven of Diamonds in the Trek Cabal
vrooooom
2005-01-29 00:06:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Merry Piper
Post by Justin
Someone called Seven of Nine a gimmick!? If it isn't Seven of Nine... the
show does not exist, VOY would of gone down as a shame in Star Trek history,
if it hasn't already. If they somehow included Section 31st in VOY, it
might of been half watchable without Seven.
Just as Gene had trouble with Patrick Stewart, most fans had trouble
with Janeway. I thought the name was a little strange, but the character
was good.
Post by The Merry Piper
How does the show existing or not existing negate the fact that a
large majority of the fan base sees Ryan being cast as 7 of 9 a
gimmick?
Most fans concur.
Post by The Merry Piper
Yeah ... when I think half-human/half-machine rescued from an insect
like collective dressed in a cat-suit, CMFP high heels, padded chest
plate, & corset.
They tried it with Lien when she was taken over by Tierin. It was good
for an episode, but they should have kept going with her as being more
fiesty.... they lost their visions...
Post by The Merry Piper
It is possible, perhaps, that an early cancellation of VOY would have
led to some serious soul searching on the part of TPTB & maybe given
us, the fans, a better product.
Section 31 perhaps?
Post by The Merry Piper
I think it is wonderful you loved the character & loved the show.
IDIC and all that. It doesn't mean the rest of us won't look at some
of the choices made & questio them.
Granted.

I do and have questioned the story lines of Enterprise, TNG and most of VOY.

The Temporal War is totally bad.
The alternate universe thing has been played out with DS9.
We had Kira and Dax in DS9, way kool.
Sisco sucked ass.
Bashir was too cool for the show.
The Cockney accent was getting on my nerves.
James Darren will live in infamy... (I remember his young werewolf)
The Doctor in VOY was way too annoying and I was tired of his tirades.
I will always like Worf.
I will always like Crusher's ass.
I got tired of "I was Borg".... bullcrap... move on and take some
prozac.......
Bakula was not meant to be a captain....
T'Pol is better with Kir Shiara (what Vulcan isnt?)
Reed needs to kill a lot of people...
and....

Hoshi needs to get laid.....

by Reed.

So there.

Vroooom
Eric Newman
2005-01-29 00:31:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by vrooooom
Post by The Merry Piper
Post by Justin
Someone called Seven of Nine a gimmick!? If it isn't Seven of Nine... the
show does not exist, VOY would of gone down as a shame in Star Trek history,
if it hasn't already. If they somehow included Section 31st in VOY, it
might of been half watchable without Seven.
Just as Gene had trouble with Patrick Stewart, most fans had trouble
with Janeway. I thought the name was a little strange, but the character
was good.
Post by The Merry Piper
How does the show existing or not existing negate the fact that a
large majority of the fan base sees Ryan being cast as 7 of 9 a
gimmick?
Most fans concur.
Post by The Merry Piper
Yeah ... when I think half-human/half-machine rescued from an insect
like collective dressed in a cat-suit, CMFP high heels, padded chest
plate, & corset.
They tried it with Lien when she was taken over by Tierin. It was good
for an episode, but they should have kept going with her as being more
fiesty.... they lost their visions...
Post by The Merry Piper
It is possible, perhaps, that an early cancellation of VOY would have
led to some serious soul searching on the part of TPTB & maybe given
us, the fans, a better product.
Section 31 perhaps?
Post by The Merry Piper
I think it is wonderful you loved the character & loved the show.
IDIC and all that. It doesn't mean the rest of us won't look at some
of the choices made & questio them.
Granted.
I do and have questioned the story lines of Enterprise, TNG and most of VOY.
The Temporal War is totally bad.
The alternate universe thing has been played out with DS9.
We had Kira and Dax in DS9, way kool.
Sisco sucked ass.
Bashir was too cool for the show.
The Cockney accent was getting on my nerves.
I don't think that was a Cockney accent.
Post by vrooooom
James Darren will live in infamy... (I remember his young werewolf)
The Doctor in VOY was way too annoying and I was tired of his tirades.
I will always like Worf.
I will always like Crusher's ass.
I got tired of "I was Borg".... bullcrap... move on and take some
prozac.......
Bakula was not meant to be a captain....
T'Pol is better with Kir Shiara (what Vulcan isnt?)
Reed needs to kill a lot of people...
and....
Hoshi needs to get laid.....
by Reed.
So there.
Vroooom
The Merry Piper
2005-01-29 00:43:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by vrooooom
The Temporal War is totally bad.
Agreed. Drop it into the trash bin bad.
Post by vrooooom
The alternate universe thing has been played out with DS9.
Judging from posts here, I am probably one of the few fans who did not
like DS9 returning to the Mirror Universe. Some stories should stand
on their own.
Post by vrooooom
We had Kira and Dax in DS9, way kool.
I liked Jadzia Dax, and I liked the concept of Kira but felt the
writers vacillated between sexy ex-terrorist & iron-butt officer on
DS9.
Post by vrooooom
Sisco sucked ass.
I liked Sisko.
Post by vrooooom
Bashir was too cool for the show.
Bashir is a good example of character development, although I could
have done without the superhuman arc.
Post by vrooooom
James Darren will live in infamy... (I remember his young werewolf)
Great guest star with a singing voice that is still bringing the house
down.
Post by vrooooom
The Doctor in VOY was way too annoying and I was tired of his tirades.
Okay, I liked the doctor, too. At least he had a personality. It was
an annoying personality, but he had one.
Post by vrooooom
I will always like Worf.
Great concept, poorly written. If he would have lived up to his
potential as a warrior, he would have had to have been removed from
the show early on. Instead, they made him a fairly sorry excuse for a
security guard.
Post by vrooooom
I will always like Crusher's ass.
I didn't like Crusher. I didn't like the character & I didn't care for
McFadden.
Post by vrooooom
Bakula was not meant to be a captain....
I'm neutral on this one. Bakula has had his moments.
Post by vrooooom
T'Pol is better with Kir Shiara (what Vulcan isnt?)
I like the concept of T'Pol, but the romance with Trip doesn't work
for me. In fact, romance in general in Trek has been poorly written.
Post by vrooooom
Reed needs to kill a lot of people...
and....
Reed needs major overhauling or a very magnificent death.
Post by vrooooom
Hoshi needs to get laid.....
I like Hoshi. I like the actress, I like the concept, I like the way
she is written ... I wouldn't change a thing.
Post by vrooooom
by Reed.
See above re: Trek romance. However, if they have to have a romance,
Reed & Hoshi is as good a pairing as any.

okay thnax bi ...

---
The Merry Piper
[http://tmpiper.livejournal.com]
The Seven of Diamonds in the Trek Cabal
EvilBill
2005-01-30 01:25:57 UTC
Permalink
vrooooom <***@earthlink.net> typed as if devouring a plate of spoo:

<snip>
Post by vrooooom
and....
Hoshi needs to get laid.....
by EvilBill
So there.
;-)
--
--
There is no spoon.

EvilBill - http://evilbill.50megs.com/index.html
My Quake2 FTP site: ftp://65.30.181.223/quake2/EvilBill/
Jack of Hearts of the Eeeevil Trek Cabal (TINC)
C***@gww.not
2005-01-31 08:30:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Justin
Oh yea fuck... seriously... excuse my language, but I really had to use that
*F word. First... I'm a star trek fan. When voyager came out, I watched a
few episodes for the first one, one and a half month, then... never ever,
ever... watched another episode of VOY again! Until... one day, a big
breast talented princess came along replaced the boring dull not bad looking
but never showed her ass/breast Kess.
You know what... I have nothing against voyager, nothing against Captain
Janeway, she's okay, but I really really want to compact the cook Neelix,
and burn it, then toss it out the air-lock. You know... some people... they
just... unwilling to admit that Neelix, and maybe Kess are the characters
that killed VOY, why are there even people defending these 2
characters?!?!!?
Someone called Seven of Nine a gimmick!? If it isn't Seven of Nine... the
show does not exist, VOY would of gone down as a shame in Star Trek history,
if it hasn't already. If they somehow included Section 31st in VOY, it
might of been half watchable without Seven.
Post by Kweeg
Post by vrooooom
I agree with you Matalie.
Janeway was a facinating character.
Seven was a gimick that shoujld have been dumped into the sixth season,
and the doctor whould have been less a pain in the ass, what whit his
dumbass "missions" of proving holograms are people too bullcrap.
Should have been more ships from the Alpha quadrant and the Gamma
quadrant coming into the Delta quadrant to screw with voyager... I was
sad to see good characters go to waste. Way too bad that Braga was
thinking with his jeans instead of his brain...
The Doctor, 7 of 9 and Tuvok were the only characters worth anything. The
captain and the helmsman were slightly less annoying than Nelix who shoulda
have been spaced right away along with Kes, the wooden XO, the precocious
1/2 Klingon, and the Ensign that didn't do anything except whimper and
occasionally cower.
Post by vrooooom
In fact, Braga should have been canned into the second season of VOY.
Tom Paris was the best character from V'ger.

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